New Member needs a little help with his smoker

[agspecialties]

OK guys make a long story short, I and my employees have decided to make a smoker to use for our annual dinner that we put on every year. The guy that I use to get to do my dinner doesn't do it anymore, so we thought that as fab shop we should be able to make a big smoker and do the dinner ourselves. Well...... We have a smoker but we are not happy with it.
Here are a couple of pictures of it.



Here is the problem. We can get our firebox hot as hell, enough to warp 1/4 plate that we built it out of, but we can't seem to get the grill hot enough. Temp on the firebox side was 230 and 180 on the opposite side.
Here is a picture of the tube that we built from the firebox


We took a 4" tube and staggered 1" weld in bungs every 12" on three sides. Our thought was that if it was too hot that we would just plug the holes. We were wrong, its not hot enough. I have one guy that thinks that the 4" isn't big enough. I have no idea?? That is why I am here.

The other problem that I see is that we need to work on our firebox. You can see by the pictures that we were cutting holes and plugging holes to get some more heat in the smoker.
Here are some pictures of the firebox.



I would like some input on this guys. I know that we will use the shit out of this smoker as soon as we get the bugs worked out of it.
I am all ears on this one, We took a shot in the dark when we built this, so take is easy on us.

[Big T]

First off yes your 4'' pipe coming from the firebox is way too small. There is a pit calculator on the main page of this site, if you run your dimensions through it you will get a formula for your build. I would start off by entering my cook chamber dimensions and build from there. It will give you a size for your fire box, throat opening from FB to CC , air intakes on FB, stack size and length. The guys on here use a baffle plate instead of a pipe, if you look at my build " The Ugly Stick I have some pics for you to get an idea of what I'm talking about and you're always welcome to ask more questions.

[jaybird302]

Yup, what he said... It wouldn't be too hard to move the stack and make that a reverse flow. A baffle plate would give you the effect you were looking for with the pipe, but be more effective. Might I suggest lifting it up a bit. The wheels seem a bit small which puts the FB pretty close to the ground. That is, unless it'll never leave the yard and you're just moving it from one spot to another. Sweet looking rig though man, I'm sure it'll do everything you want once you get it sorted out.

Jay

[jaybird302]

One more observation, I'd find a way to seal up your FB lid. I bet you're losing a lot of heat out of the lid...

[The Czar]

Got to say… What they said… It's all about the draft baby ...all about the draft....


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[agspecialties]

Hey thanks a lot guys, I was afraid of that 4" being to freaking small. We have a lot of work on that damn pipe. I will look into that pit calculator.
I will keep you guys posted on this. Thanks again

[Clover Ridge Smokers]

It looks like the boys have you pointed in the right direction. If it were me, I would turn this thing into a reverse flow. Run the pit through the calculator and see what you come up with.

[agspecialties]

It looks like the boys have you pointed in the right direction. If it were me, I would turn this thing into a reverse flow. Run the pit through the calculator and see what you come up with.

I am a little confused????? and very new at this?????!!!!!LOL. What would we have to do to make this into a "reverse flow" smoker??
Just move the stack from one side to the other side?

[Puff]

When you run the pit calculator, you will find some really interesting numbers for your cooker. The reverse flow would mean recutting the junction between the firebox and the cook chamber and relocating the stack. By adding a solid sealed plate just above the top of the fire box cutout into the cook chamber, from the left side to about 4" or so from the right side,( which looks like 7 feet or so in your case) you will create a flow of heat that runs from the fire, under the plate to the gap at the right side then as part of the draft, that flow will reverse direction and want to escape from the stack on the opposite side. All along, the radiant heat from the sealed plate, will help create cook temperature inside the chamber all controlled by the firebox damper in combination with the stack

[jaybird302]

I am a little confused????? and very new at this?????!!!!!LOL. What would we have to do to make this into a "reverse flow" smoker?? Just move the stack from one side to the other side?

The short answer is yes. Moving the stack to exit above the FB and then adding a plate under your cooking grates to direct heat and smoke to the far end of the CC. So basically, your heat/smoke is traveling under the baffle plate to the end and then back again to the stack. I'm sure there will be someone along soon who can explain this better or even knows where to direct you for a visual.

[Puff]

What kind of measurements do you have on the firebox and the cook chamber as it stands currently?

[Big T]

If you look in the Reverse flow builds under The Ugly Stick there's some pretty good pictures .

[agspecialties]

What kind of measurements do you have on the firebox and the cook chamber as it stands currently?

Well, I am shooting from the hip. The CC is 96 long 49 wide and 40 tall. The FB is 48 long 22.5 wide and 20 tall.

[Puff]

Did you try these numbers in the pit calculator? Here's what I came up with...wow

One or the other..smaller cook chamber or bigger fire box?

[agspecialties]

yah that is what I came up with. I guess we need to go bigger on the firebox. Will have to look at it and come up with something.

[Clover Ridge Smokers]

I'm really impressed how everyone has jumped on this to help out a fellow builder. Nice job guys!!

Agspecialties, where in the country are you located? People on this site are from all over the USA and chances are there is someone close to you who has a RF that you could look at to get ideas on how to fix yours.

[agspecialties]

With a firebox that big, what the hell do I do, stack a bunch of wood in it and let it just burn??

[agspecialties]

I'm really impressed how everyone has jumped on this to help out a fellow builder. Nice job guys!!

Agspecialties, where in the country are you located? People on this site are from all over the USA and chances are there is someone close to you who has a RF that you could look at to get ideas on how to fix yours.

I am from Nebraska, and I am really impressed with the response that I am getting. THANK YOU. I have a pretty good idea what we have to do to fix this monster. I am going to go into the shop tomorrow and start to cut on it in the morning. Will keep you guys posted.
First thing is to make the firebox bigger, going to make it from 48 x 22.5 x 20. Thinking of going to 48x40x34. Now what I don't know it what I am going to do with all of that space?? That seems really big, but by the pit calculator that is what I am looking at.
Second thing is to rip that damn pipe out and cut a 48 x 6 slot in the CC and put a baffle plate in.
One thing that concerns me is that little firebox that I had, we had that thing up to 800 degrees. WHere was all the heat going??

[Big T]

Glad we could help out, I think your opening will need to be 48'' x10-1/4'' that'll give ya 492 sq inches. I think once you get your pit to spec that you'll find that you don't need a raging fire to maintain temps. I think your problem was lack of volume of hot air in the FB and a bottleneck getting into the CC. As to where the heat was going?????? all I can say is not in your CC.

[Puff]

Gee, we have some refineries up north here that have 8" stacks too ...( just kiddin')

How many people come to the event you described ? Do you need a cooker this large? Might cutting it down be an alternative to the much bigger firebox ? In playing around with the numbers I am approximating nearly 800 gallons in volume size.

Just a thought

[Gizmo]

WELCOME FELLOW NEBRASKAN!

Agspecialties welcome to the site. Looks like you got quite a project on your hands here. So what kind of CC temps are you getting now?

I would make changes in a logical progression. Could save you a lot of time and money. The way I see it the FB size is the biggest PITA you have to deal with. Put it off till last - if at all.

So I would fix the worst infraction first. In this case it's the throat size - followed by the stack length. Some of your critical numbers are off some but your throat is nearly non-existant (7.3% of the recommended) and there is no way that stack is 86 inches tall. Any rig with an 800F FB and a CC that's too cold has a breathing problem. Changing the throat and stack will have a HUGE effect on the respiratory condition of this critter.

Remove the internal pipe with the holes in it that you picture under the grate.
Cut open the throat to at least 172 sq. inches area.
Find a piece of the same diameter pipe your current stack is made out of and aluminum tape it to the end of what's there to take it out to the 86 inches. Maybe some tack welds under the tape but this "splice" has to be airtight. Only has to hold it briefly. This will give the stack the total cu. inches of hot air it needs to create a good "pull" on the rig which effects your draft's effectiveness.
It is now an End-fed design but HEY! they work good too!

Light the fire at 2/3 draft (65%) and a wide open stack (if you have a damper I didn't see).

At that point you have surrounded the FB size problem and the resulting CC temp will tell you volumes about what you accomplished and what to do next. imho

[Rodcrafter]

Glad you found the site and all this help. The idea you guys had is really cool about the pipe with the bung fittings,it just doesn't allow enough air movement. You asked a question, where did all this heat go that you had in the FB? The answer is out the top of your FB, the plate steel you saw warping was that heat getting out the only way it could. The systematic progression Gizmo has told you about will do a few things, it will teach you and help you understand just what is going on in this really nice cooker you guys made. You asked another question, what will I have to do just build a great big fire in this huge FB? The answer is no, if you will look at some of the fire boxes on this site you will see that they often have an basket in them and a door on the side to add wood or charcoal whatever fuel you want to use. The best part of a basket is it keeps my coals built up in one spot so when I add a split or two they are consumed and added to the pile of hot coals. This pile heats the air in the fire box the air is what carries the smoke to the CC and out the stack. You will be surprised how small the fire really will need to be, to make this huge cooker work like a charm. You did understand the thing Gizmo was saying about the stack is just for your learning purposes. The whole you cut between the CC and FB will remain so you want to cut that as low as possible with the top of that hole being at the same height as the top of your FB. If you don't make it into an RF you will need to leave a small approximately 1 inch high dam at the bottom of the CC so when your cooking alot of meat the grease doesn't run into your FB and cause one really big fire. If you decide to make it into an Reverse Flow as you grow in your learning curve, that plate will need to be at that same height inside the CC and the dam will need to be at the open end of that plate.

I know we have given you a lot to think about, but we will answer any questions we can.

jm2cw

[agspecialties]

WELCOME FELLOW NEBRASKAN!

Agspecialties welcome to the site. Looks like you got quite a project on your hands here. So what kind of CC temps are you getting now?

I would make changes in a logical progression. Could save you a lot of time and money. The way I see it the FB size is the biggest PITA you have to deal with. Put it off till last - if at all.

So I would fix the worst infraction first. In this case it's the throat size - followed by the stack length. Some of your critical numbers are off some but your throat is nearly non-existant (7.3% of the recommended) and there is no way that stack is 86 inches tall. Any rig with an 800F FB and a CC that's too cold has a breathing problem. Changing the throat and stack will have a HUGE effect on the respiratory condition of this critter.

Remove the internal pipe with the holes in it that you picture under the grate.
Cut open the throat to at least 172 sq. inches area.
Find a piece of the same diameter pipe your current stack is made out of and aluminum tape it to the end of what's there to take it out to the 86 inches. Maybe some tack welds under the tape but this "splice" has to be airtight. Only has to hold it briefly. This will give the stack the total cu. inches of hot air it needs to create a good "pull" on the rig which effects your draft's effectiveness.
It is now an End-fed design but HEY! they work good too!

Light the fire at 2/3 draft (65%) and a wide open stack (if you have a damper I didn't see).

At that point you have surrounded the FB size problem and the resulting CC temp will tell you volumes about what you accomplished and what to do next. imho

Alright, we came into the shop this morning and after a long conversation with the guys, we are going to do the following.
Throat size change
Bigger opening in the firebox
Baffle plates
and relocate the four inch stack to the other side. Now the question from there is the stack size and length. What should we use? Now its a 4" very short stack.

[Rodcrafter]

I would say since you are moving the stack, I would agree use the correct size. If you have 8" use an 22" long piece, if you have 6" use an 38" piece.

[agspecialties]

Next question, with lots to come I bet.
After doing the pit calculator and coming up with the number that we need. In the air intake section, what is the COUNT for ? We have an opening of 24x6 with the intake of 64.80 inch squared at Count .45. What does this mean??